Ok today I just got back from a autocross and I have decided Iam going to need a racing harness. Every turn I make I find myself fighting just tryin to stay in the seat. Its really distracting and cumbersome. I would like to know though for those people who are running them where you are bolting them to, other then a roll bar. I have a completely stock interior and would like to keep it that way because it is my daily driver. And I would also like to keep the stock seat belt for normal driving.
-Thanks Brandon

A lot of us would not have roll bars if there was a good alternative.....A proper roll bar is the only truly safe method I know of and it will allow you to be safe at higher speed events. Then you will have seat issues.

LG used to make a harness bar but I think they stopped making it. I have known people to make their own harness bars. I don't think harness bars are even legal in most venues but you can probably get away with it at some AX events.

Unfortunately, you are pretty much stuck.

Bock

I have a LG harness bar.. thats how I have my belts mounted, as well as a camera mount.

Nobody has ever questioned me about it.

However.. it does make your rear seats useless, and it's a PITA to put in and take out.. even once a month if thats how you'd use it.

I bought mine used, and I've seen them for sale from time to time on LS2.

www.cglock.com

I think you can buy these through Stranoparts as well. I love mine.

Ditto

You could do a harness bar/ rollbar(not good for a street car), sub bracket, and the stock seatbelt mounting points, but ONLY for autoxing! None of those mounting points even come close to being correct for a high speed impact!

I bought a harness with snap in ends and eyebolts. I drilled into the floorboards and panel behind the backseat then backed up the holes with LARGE washers. I've been using this harnes for over 5 years (yeah, I know its too old) for autocross only and it is fine. Just make sure you drill your holes in the right spot, there are other posts here for locations.

One easy thing to try is a torso belt. Might make enough difference, it's cheap, and you don't have to install anything.

Here's an example of one.

http://www.soloperformance.com/ShoppingCar...%20Torso%20Belt

Howdy,

In your situation (wanting to keep your butt planted without affecting other systems and (presumably) without spending a ton of money...

Install a lap belt in addition to the stock belts. Easy want to do it is to buy a new five point latch/link harness and only install the lapbelt portion.

Use bolt in ends and bolt the tabs under the stock seat belt mounts. It won't affect you on the road (when you're not using the lap belt) and it will hold your but in the seat during an autox firmly, with the (also worn) stock belt system providing crash safety.

It will hold you in the seat _well_ and should only cost you <$75.

Mark

You would be suprized how much a lap belt or CG lock can help.

I have a harness bar - which I like.

I have tried the twist the belt method at AutoX, and pretended it was a CG Lock.. but bought a harness bar from a member of this site.

They are out there if you look, or you can fab one up.

If you are fighting to stay in your seat you may want to skip the CG Lock and go straight to a harness bar. But, that might mean a race seat too, because shoulder straps and the stock seats suck... They will pull on you shoulders instead.

I do like marka's lap belt only idea. I did that every now and again when I had the stock seat and 5 point harness. the lower 3 points of the 5 point system keep you planted pretty good.

If you don't want a race seat then use the lab/anti-sub belt method. Otherwise go the whole way with a seat and belts. (the cg lock has no anti-sub and the belt is narrower then race belts... ala comfort.)

MHO

$33.69

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.a...mp;autoview=sku

Cheap and very effective-I always liked the idea of a 3" lap belt vs the narrow stocker. I'm now using a harness bar, soon to be replaced with a roll bar, and a 5pt + Kirkey. I might have the LG Harness bar for sale soon.

THere you go -- Get in line for Rob's harness bar!!
=)

Good link Rob. But I strongly suggest the anti-sub belt too. I tried driving with and without it and felt better with it.

Cool thanks for all the help. I will probly buy that lap belt and I may look into some aftermarket seats but don't look too out of place in the car. That way they can hold me better in the seat, I hope. If there are any more ideas keep them coming iam open to any suggestions.
-Brandon

http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/stores/serv...ategoryId=10495

There's another option (though a lap belt works well).

Hey that one's even a couple dollars less than the one I posted...

And still from a sponsor too.

Quick note on the Torso harness. if you are a BIG person (like me, 6'2" 260#) bear in mind that the torso harness is strapping you to the seat back, which is held by a flimsy little seat clip to keep it from going forward (as the factory allows for rear seat entry). It is also the only thing keeping you in the seat laterally other than the lap belt. BTW the stock seats were never designed for this lateral loading high up in the chest area.

I have used the Torso Harness a fair amount. It needs to be tight across the chest to be effective. It limits to some extent your breathing, and if a large person, the lateral forces are enough to cause the narrow belt to dig into your skin.

Just want you to have all the facts before moving forward. I too feel like the lap belt suggested by marka sounds like the best alternative for you.

Bock

I don't trust the torso belts. If there's an accident, there will be an awful lot of stress on the spine at roughly the position of the strap.

I use the twisted belt technique. It takes a little experimenting to find the right angles and lengths, but once you find the right reference spot to point the buckle at while twisting, it is very repeatable.

Remember, aftermarket seats will take you out of stock. But I agree, stock seats and belts in an F body suck. Good job on Sunday, I wish I could have made it.

The Pontiac seats have deeper bolsters, is it legal in stock to swap into a Camaro?

There is a guy out here that has made a few sets of seat bolsters that work quite well at keeping the butt planted in the seat, and that helps a lot to control the torso. He takes 2 blocks of foam about 12" long, sizes one to fit snug between the console and the drivers right thigh, and the other one between the door and the drivers left thigh. Then he sews a fabric cover that encases both pieces of foam and connects their bottom inside edges together with a butt sized piece of fabric. You put this on the seat, drop into it, and shutting the door wedges it all together. The cover keeps them from popping out. Works well, doesn't need any hardware or mods to the car. Dunno if it would raise any eyebrows in FS.

I use some leather conditioner on my seats to hold my butt to the seat for a few OT laps. Just spray it on and leave it before each run.

It might work for autox'ing

If you want a DOT legal 4-point harness made by a leader in safety restraint systems check out Schroth street legal harnesses...

P.S. I forgot they shouldn't be used with a Camaro because the stock Camaro seat is a neck/head injury waiting to happen! You could use a 4 point harness with the stock seat, but you don't ever want to be in a collision with that setup! In otherwords maybe autocross only, not for street or track use. I was extremely happy the day my stock seats came out and the kirkey's went in... I like having my head and neck supported!

Cool this is what I was looking for. Is this the kind I need to get for my formula?
http://www.schrothracing.com/products/streetlegal/1574
If not could you post the link to the right one.
-Brandon

Hehe. I find the Kirkey to be immensely more comfortable than the stockers.

Rob,

I added another layer of dense foam on my seat bottoms -- the Intermediate Road Race seats.

HUGE improvement in comfort.

Taken from the instructions for each harness:

Autocontrol III



Rallye 3 ASM



Rallye 4 ASM/Rallye Cross


Looks like the Rallye 3 ASM or Rallye 4 ASM/Rallye Cross would be the best ones for an F-body. The F-body (or any Chevrolet) is not in the approved list for the Autocontrol III D & E mounting points. The Autocontrol III also has an electronic belt locking sensor that is installed and requires the car to be parked FLAT, not tilted laterally or longitudinally.

For any harness the stock seats are still a concern though. Check out the harness instructions: http://www.schrothracing.com/docs/Rallye_Instructions.pdf

Hmmm I've been meaning to try that. The bottom is the only place that gets uncomfortable on a long drive. Mine is also a Kirkey Inter. RR seat.