I'm considering doing some drag racing--just a little bit--at an event held by one of the local clubs, here in Mass... The thing is, I've done a ton of drag runs in a Mustang, but never in my Camaro.

There's got to be a trick to launching with street tires, without breaking the rear-end or smoking the clutch...right? Anyone care to eleborate? I figure bump the konis to soft (I have SAs) and that's about all I can do. I have a T2R if that even matters and I'll be on street tires--Azenis 615s.



-John

I can't believe I'm seeing a thread with the words "drag race" here......but to answer the question.



Smoking the clutch or breaking the rear isn't going to be the problem, hooking up is going to be the problem, I had to feather the clutch quite a bit on the LT1 to get it to grab and I would bet that is going to be the technique you end up using.

Yeah, on the LS1, from what I understand it's a fine line between bogging it off the line and lighting 'em up. If somebody in the local club could let you borrow some stickies, that would be a big plus.

Drag racing?


BAN HIM





The one (yes, one) pass I made at SLP day (before I had even made one car payment) was bogged badly. I launched at 900 rpm (like leaving a traffic light) and "drove" it down the track (no power shifting, etc). I ran a 14.04@102.5. I was watching everyone before me smoke the tires (hard) and was trying to decide how to launch mine (while staging), I was suddenly staged and the lights came down (and I'm still wondering how to launch the car). So, I just eased out the clutch and "off I went".

I suspect that you'll be slipping the clutch on the start in an effort to stay in the power band, avoid overpowering the tires and keep from bogging the car. That's probably the best way, but you are trading clutch wear for et and saving the tires and rear (not that you should break a rear on street tires).

Oh yeah, no need to do a burnout on street tires. Won't help and you're liable to just sling water up in the wheel wells to drip back down while you're staged. Avoid the water box.

It's fun to mix it up once in a while, ain't it? I'm curious what I can make this car do. It's basically stock an air lid and a catback are the only power type mods.

So you bring it to a certain RPM and feather the clutch a bit, then WOT when you feel it hook? That's the way I used to launch my old Mustang. I wasn't all that great at it... Get it up to 3,000RPM, feather it, feel it hook and then you're off. The deal was not to bog it.

-John
(banned )

A easy little mod that will help your launch is to disconnect your sway bar endlinks. Takes five minutes and helps with weight transfer. Just connect it when your done, unless you like the feeling of driving a 1978 Cadillac El Dorado.......

Front swaybar only.
On street tires it probably won't matter.

What I used to do was let the clutch out fairly quick (not quite a sidestep dump, but close) at around 2500 and half-throttle, let the tires spin a bit just to avoid bogging, feather the throttle to get it to hook, and then roll back into the throttle.

What I do now with the UETA is still launch around 2500 and half throttle, but I ignore the wheelspin completely and just go quickly but smoothly to full throttle and the car will just automatically hook up on its own

Feathering the clutch overheats it too easily, and then it won't stop slipping.

Until your T2R goes south!!!

Bam, its over in a heartbeat.

Steve

Concur w/ Sean's 2500 rpm launch; that seems to work best for me as well. No strip times, but plenty of practice, er, "product evaluation" sessions... :leaving:

Drop rear tire pressures, but not too much. No less than 26 or 25 psi. A quick dry burnout (no water box) wouldn't hurt, just to put a little heat in the tires.

Besides, it's great practice for AX starts!

Street tires tend to get greasy when you heat them up. The objective is to go around the water box, do a quick, dry spin of your tires, just enough to throw the gravel out of them, and then nice and easy off the line. To be honest, I think 2500 is a bit high for a street tire launch. I'd go more like 22 or 2300.

I've done quite a few of 1/4 mile passes in my Firebird {somewhere around 250} and my best 60fts come from slipping the clutch out rather than trying to find a certain rpm in which to drop the clutch. The easiest and best way to describe my launch is to pretend that you are leaving a red light right next to a cop. Roughly the same clutch release speed except that you are at 3/4 to full throttle. I say roughly because there are so many variables due to track conditions a tires. Sometimes I would have to slip almost all the way through 1st, sometimes I could release the clutch as stated above.

I've had plenty of sub 2.0 sixty foots on the stock Firestone Firehawks, the best was a 1.90 sixty foot. I would remove the front sway, every bit helps and it doesn't take long. AND,,, as someone had already suggested. It's great practice for AutoX starts! I used to road race motorcycles and my 1/4 mile experience really helped allot. I would generally pass at least 3-4 people right at the start. Drag racing can be useful and fun,,,, as long as you don't do it all the time. It gets old after awhile

I have the same tires as you Spooner, and i havent done any racing this year, except i was able to go to a dragstrip last week. I suspect my clutch is on its last leg for dragracing, but its fine for everything else, but here is a little video of a 2.140 60ft time i made, this was with the trans/clutch hot, and its hard to tell in the video, but i held rpms around 3000 or 3500 and let the clutch out somewhat rapidly, the motor was bogging down as my crappy clutch was slipping for another second or so after i was off of the clutch, i think after that is where you can here the motor actually start to wind up (since it was bogging to catch up with the slipping clutch). my two other runs that day were both 2.003 and 2.004 60ft's, but the clutch was colder for them.

http://members.cox.net/milkac/thompson.wmv

anywyas, i've dragraced with the nitto 555r2's before these tires (and my clutch was in better shape at that time also) and the nitto's grip much better, but your probably half way there or more than halfway there compared to a high mileage street tire.

personally, i would slip the clutch, but i hear of some guys that leave just above idle that can still get good 60ft times, i have no idea how, i need MINIMUM 2200rpm to keep from bogging, and that usually takes quite a bit of feathering, i find that i feather less if i use a higher rpm, but that may be since i had stickier tires and a better clutch at the time.

either way, its gonna be hard to get a decent start, especially if your track doesnt prep well.

I just wish i had the time to take my car to an autox/track day with these tires like i intended them for, its a waste wearing them down on the street.

Anybody ever drag on Victoracers? Would you do a burnout with them? I have a set that will be done by the end of the year that I wouldn't mind using at the drag strip. I just fear breaking the car (tranny/rear/clutch) with the Victoracers. The car will also be terrible with the RR setup and 225# rear springs?

Come to Columbus on the 18th and run with the OVR SCCA group (I'll be there working on some changes to the car....it could be bad, it could be good).

www.ovr-scca.org

i've wanted to come down and race with you guys before, but its that 2 hour drive, not sure its worth it. the reason i havent been autocrossing this year is i cant set aside nearly an entire day for a specific activity, just have too much catching up to do on weekends to do that anymore (read - damn engineering college is ruining my life!).

but i'll try to make it when i can. I am doing down closer to you for mid-ohio with the norpca, registered for that months ago and scheduled time off of work to prepare the car.

Miki

We have a guy who comes down from your area, he's running a Covette in SM2 (my competition) this year. It's not that far.....(ok, maybe it is).

Guys,

Thanks for all of the suggestions. Very helpful.

One more question. What about shift points? Do you generally run it to the redline, or shift a little earlier? And I'd imagine in a stock-geared car, once you get it in third, just stand on it through the traps?

What will a well-driven, basically stock LS1 car run? Low 13s?

Thanks,

-John

A stock LS1 should be shifted somewhere around 5800 if I remember right. You want to shift right as the horspower starts to fall off. Problem is, the stock tach is a bit slow and you will just have to figure out where to shift to get the best times. But, 5800 sounds about right.

Bone stock LS1s generaly run low to mid 13s if driven well. I ran a 13.40@104 at Bristol TN {around 2000ft above sea level} in 90 degree temps. Later, I added a LID and some drag radials and ran a 12.98@108 at a seal level track in 70 degree temps.

i have the harlan shift light, and before my camswap, i would shift at 5800, now i shift at 6400 - but the mtor is a bit different.

anywyas, i think the idea is that when you shift, you want to motor to end up at peak torque (which on stock ls1 is something like 4500rpm iirc). this way you are in the power band as much as possible.

my car also has the stock 3.42 rear gears, and unless i really screwed up and missed a shift or something, i would ALWAYS need 4th gear, its right at the end of the track, but if i didnt, i would be all over that rev limiter in 3rd gear.

now i didnt get low to mid 13's till i had most of the bolt ons in my case. maybe i suck and driving (ok, i know thats true), but maybe my technique isnt all that great, but i'm going from alot of internet research, so take it for what its worth i guess

Okay here goes my story on the Victoracers.. I had a Detroit locker in the car and there was no way you were going to smoke any tire with stick to it. I hated the Detroit because of the slop in the C-Locker and canned it for a T2R. The day we put the T2R in a mechanic friend and I decided to try it out on the street with Victo's mounted. We took a couple of freeway u-turns off the ramps and I hammered it pretty good..no slip. So anyways we pulled up to a stop sign and I left about 3 grand...nothing but putting the power down. So's I fugure lets try that again at about 4000. The car hooked up hard and when I hit 2nd the clutch said goodbye. Oh, well, needed a new "fuse" anyway. I wouldn't bother to burn out on Victo's just clean them a little, if at all. Kind of get into the damp spot just out of the burnout box and just spin them over. Don't try any dry hops; just stage and be kind to your clutch. I think you'll still break the clutch before you get the T2R.

I think I'll stick to roadracing......seems easier on the car!