 The Blue Collar Brake Kit for 3rd Gens |
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 Mar 27 2013, 02:37 AM
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#1
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Veteran Member  Group: Advanced Members Posts: 3,323 Joined: 30-March 06 From: Detroit Suburbs Member No.: 1,144  |
I’ve been working on this kit for a little over 6 months now. I’ve updated the design a couple times and what you see below is the final.
(IMG:http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o33/StanIROCZ/Brakes/Wilwood/IMG_0706_zps2c3704ea.jpg) (IMG:http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o33/StanIROCZ/Brakes/Wilwood/IMG_0718_zpsbed6f4e1.jpg) (IMG:http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o33/StanIROCZ/Brakes/Wilwood/DAB33716-62F2-474D-9DF4-ECE860ECE0F3-15879-000015A40CCBD82E.jpg) (IMG:http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o33/StanIROCZ/Brakes/Wilwood/44F42AA0-DF0F-4264-9125-335A5852A432-15879-000015A3F07E410A.jpg) (IMG:http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o33/StanIROCZ/Brakes/Wilwood/IMG_0701_zps8e73cd71.jpg) This kit is for 3rd gens and uses the very affordable Wilwood SL4i calipers and C5/C6 rotors. This has to be the best value in brakes possible; Calipers are ~$150 each new if you shop around, C6 rotors are durable and around $50 each, and pads are your typical $150-170 but are 0.8” thick and therefore have a very long life. So low entry price (about even with C5) and the lowest possible consumable cost. With the 3rd bolt there is more stiffness in the bracket and the loads and stresses are better distributed onto the spindle. With the higher stiffness you can expect less deflection and better pad wear. As far as the stresses into the spindle I’ve never heard of a 3rd gen spindle failing under braking but I also don’t want to be the first one, so for my piece of mind the extra bolt is worth the expense. New pads are 0.8” thick including the plate. After 2 days on track pad thickness was 0.750 to 0.705, so I anticipate the life that Nape has reported (6 race weekends IIRC). My car is ~3060 with driver and Nape is lighter than that, so yeah our cars are light but I still believe this to be very good pad life, which in the long run will save you a ton of money on consumables if you go to the track a lot. This kit is $150 and includes brackets, spacers, Grade 8 bolts and washers. These brackets are larger than your typical Ed Miller 2 bolt design so there is more material to start with and more machining time required, and I include hardware. They are laser cut from 0.5” cold roll steel and then the edges are cleaned up and the holes are drilled on a CNC mill. Group Purchase Offer: if we can get 5 buyers by April 30th we can offer a lower price of $125 for the kit. I will post up a complete parts list later and I'm also working with Trackbird on the sponsor banner thing. Thanks for the interest. Stan |
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Mar 27 2013, 02:45 AM
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#2
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Veteran Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 3,323 Joined: 30-March 06 From: Detroit Suburbs Member No.: 1,144 |
The biggest design change that I made from my original was I made the bracket area round the steering arm smaller so that brake ducts can be fit:
(IMG:http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o33/StanIROCZ/Brakes/Wilwood/IMG_0525_zpsee3d98b3.jpg) (IMG:http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o33/StanIROCZ/Brakes/Wilwood/IMG_0723_zps8fbf30fa.jpg) |
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Mar 27 2013, 02:56 AM
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#3
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Full NVH Group: Moderators Posts: 444 Joined: 16-July 07 From: Grove City, Ohio Member No.: 1,854 |
kinda sad I have my brakes done already...... looks really good. the brake ducts are very nice....
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Mar 27 2013, 03:17 AM
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#4
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Experienced Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 1,038 Joined: 29-December 03 From: Texas, USA Member No.: 62 |
Really REALLY nice job Stan!!! Those look awesome!!!
Costas cars and such... |
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Mar 27 2013, 11:42 AM
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#5
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Experienced Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 2,283 Joined: 4-May 04 From: Kenvil, NJ Member No.: 331 |
Interesting design. If I have the Ed Miller kit I'm assuming I can just drill and tap the third hole, what size thread, and what hub? I think my spindles are flexing a bit since both rotors are making contact with the caliper carriers on my C4 HD kit.
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Mar 27 2013, 01:50 PM
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#6
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Veteran Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 3,323 Joined: 30-March 06 From: Detroit Suburbs Member No.: 1,144 |
QUOTE (slowTA @ Mar 27 2013, 07:42 AM)  Interesting design. If I have the Ed Miller kit I'm assuming I can just drill and tap the third hole, what size thread, and what hub? I think my spindles are flexing a bit since both rotors are making contact with the caliper carriers on my C4 HD kit. I’m using 7/16-20 bolts but if you’re spindles are already tapped for M12 that is fine you’ll just have ream the holes in the bracket for the slightly larger bolts. The hubs are the regular Camaro rotors cut down, or S10 rotors work as well. For C6 rotors the OD needs to be just under 6” as I recall. For C5 they can be larger. |
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Mar 27 2013, 02:10 PM
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#7
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Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 222 Joined: 5-July 08 From: Virginia Beach Member No.: 2,237 |
Makes me wish I had a Third Gen just for this kit. Well done bud. You put some work into it and it shows.
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Mar 27 2013, 03:46 PM
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#8
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Experienced Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 2,283 Joined: 4-May 04 From: Kenvil, NJ Member No.: 331 |
So the standard hub, the non- 1LE hub, right?
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Mar 27 2013, 04:28 PM
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#9
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Veteran Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 3,323 Joined: 30-March 06 From: Detroit Suburbs Member No.: 1,144 |
QUOTE (slowTA @ Mar 27 2013, 11:46 AM) So the standard hub, the non- 1LE hub, right? correct. |
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Mar 27 2013, 05:32 PM
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#10
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Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 244 Joined: 27-January 04 Member No.: 158 |
will the 1le hubs work?
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Mar 27 2013, 05:46 PM
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#11
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FRRAX Owner/Admin Group: Admin Posts: 15,428 Joined: 13-February 04 From: Ohio Member No.: 196 |
QUOTE (souseless @ Mar 27 2013, 01:32 PM) will the 1le hubs work? As I remember (Stan, correct me if I'm wrong), the 1LE hubs have a slightly wider track and will relocate the rotor. That will prevent it from lining up with the caliper properly. |
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Mar 27 2013, 06:15 PM
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#12
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Experienced Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 2,283 Joined: 4-May 04 From: Kenvil, NJ Member No.: 331 |
I "think" the 1LE rotor pushes everything out 0.100", so if you already have those hubs then I guess you can space the caliper out another tenth... if you had to.
This post has been edited by slowTA: Mar 27 2013, 06:58 PM |
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Mar 27 2013, 08:30 PM
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#13
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Veteran Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 3,323 Joined: 30-March 06 From: Detroit Suburbs Member No.: 1,144 |
Yes, if the hub is wider you should be able to add some washers between the bracket and spindle to move everything out a little bit.
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Mar 27 2013, 10:05 PM
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#14
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I build race cars Group: Advanced Members Posts: 4,748 Joined: 31-August 05 From: Central coast, CA Member No.: 874 |
QUOTE (StanIROCZ @ Mar 27 2013, 06:50 AM) The hubs are the regular Camaro rotors cut down, or S10 rotors work as well. For C6 rotors the OD needs to be just under 6” as I recall. For C5 they can be larger. This is a detail that sometimes gets overlooked - I had a set of 3rd gen brake stuff in the shop that had hubs that weren't cut down *quite* enough - a radius on the ID of the rotor would hang up on the OD of the hub. It wasn't very much, and a more casual installer might have just put them on and turned the car loose. Rotors for a given application from different manufacturers may have different dimensions here, so best to double check closely when installing new rotors. I took .050 or so off the OD of the hub to fix. |
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Mar 27 2013, 10:08 PM
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#15
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I build race cars Group: Advanced Members Posts: 4,748 Joined: 31-August 05 From: Central coast, CA Member No.: 874 |
Stan - Outstanding work! These are the first brackets I've seen for the 3rd gen that I think are properly designed.
How did you get that nice radius on the OD of the spindle plate? |
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Mar 28 2013, 03:21 AM
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#16
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Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 244 Joined: 27-January 04 Member No.: 158 |
will you be selling the brake duct adapters?
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Mar 28 2013, 03:25 AM
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#17
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Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 244 Joined: 27-January 04 Member No.: 158 |
and while I'm asking questions, what about braided lines?
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Mar 28 2013, 04:24 AM
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#18
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Veteran Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 3,323 Joined: 30-March 06 From: Detroit Suburbs Member No.: 1,144 |
QUOTE (Blainefab @ Mar 27 2013, 06:05 PM) QUOTE (StanIROCZ @ Mar 27 2013, 06:50 AM) The hubs are the regular Camaro rotors cut down, or S10 rotors work as well. For C6 rotors the OD needs to be just under 6” as I recall. For C5 they can be larger. This is a detail that sometimes gets overlooked - I had a set of 3rd gen brake stuff in the shop that had hubs that weren't cut down *quite* enough - a radius on the ID of the rotor would hang up on the OD of the hub. It wasn't very much, and a more casual installer might have just put them on and turned the car loose. Rotors for a given application from different manufacturers may have different dimensions here, so best to double check closely when installing new rotors. I took .050 or so off the OD of the hub to fix. Alan, you are absolutely right. QUOTE (Blainefab @ Mar 27 2013, 06:08 PM) Stan - Outstanding work! These are the first brackets I've seen for the 3rd gen that I think are properly designed. How did you get that nice radius on the OD of the spindle plate? thanks Alan! For the brake duct plate I used 0.065" aluminum sheet, cut out a ~9" circle, drilled a 1/4" pilot hole, then clamped it between these 2 pieces of 3/4 plywood, (IMG:http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o33/StanIROCZ/Brakes/Wilwood/photo_zps96a93f78.jpg) Then hammered the edge over. For everyone else but Alan, I think this is all a bit more elaborate than what is really necessary to do a good job cooling the brakes so don't think this level of detail is necessary.... quite honestly I'm not sure I will even benefit from them since I have really only noticed the slightest hint of brake fade, and that was with my C5 calipers. I'm adding ABS so I plan on using the brakes harder and I thought ducts might be on my list of low hanging fruit so I'm doing it, for the right reasons or not. |
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Mar 28 2013, 04:29 AM
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#19
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Veteran Member Group: Advanced Members Posts: 3,323 Joined: 30-March 06 From: Detroit Suburbs Member No.: 1,144 |
QUOTE (souseless @ Mar 27 2013, 11:21 PM) will you be selling the brake duct adapters? I would like to, but with my time commitments currently I don't think I can since it would be me doing the fabrication. We'll see how this all takes off and where the demand ends up. If Alan wants to pick it up the work be my guest. QUOTE (souseless @ Mar 27 2013, 11:25 PM) and while I'm asking questions, what about braided lines? There are some options. I went with AN-3 using some adapter fittings that I can post up PN's for. |
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Mar 28 2013, 06:13 PM
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#20
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newbie Group: Members Posts: 33 Joined: 29-November 07 Member No.: 2,023 |
Wow this looks like a great kit. Almost makes me wish I had not done my LS1 brake conversion last year!
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